Saturday, December 01, 2007

anyone who equate tamils with ltte is a racist

person calling himself oao asithri aka scorpion is going around the blogs posting basically the same idiotic comment. its main (and only coherent) point seems to be that tamils are terrorists and as such should be killed/deported/etc etc. everyone can see that he is a racist fool (probably a spoof as well) and should be dismissed as such.

the point i am making is that he is not the only one who hold the racist view that tamils are terrorists. two main political groups hold that view. and that does not include any of the elected political parties in the south who are very explicit in making the distinction between tamils and terrorists (oao asithri aka scorpion if real would not find anyone to vote for). no, the groups who equate tamils with ltte terrorists, are ltte itself and the peaceniks. only difference with oao asithri aka scorpion is that they advocate and support another kind of ethnic cleansing.

ltte is explicit in its racism and knows that propagating the myth of tamil support for its terror tactics is a vital item of its survival.

peaceniks like paikiasothy saravanamuttu, jehan perera, jayadeva uyangoda, sunila abeysekera, sunanda deshapriya, nimalka fernando, rohan edirisinha, jeevan thiagarajaha, and their ilk (and their underlings like sanjana hattotuwa) support and believe ltte's racist claim to be a representative of tamils. they base their actions and statements ( most of which go against principles of human rights, democracy, justice and freedom) on that belief. they are willing to excuse and ignore, ltte's killings, ethnic cleansing, oppression of people under ltte control, and lot of other atrocities, because of this racism. in other words they are as racist as oao asithri aka scorpion (difference is that while oao asithri aka scorpion will not find any political group with power to carry out his intended horrors, peaceniks mentioned are supporting a group that is already carrying out such horrors)

in addition there are also individual peaceniks (esp. in the blogosphere) who adapt such racist views without even realizing they are racist (or their essential similarity to oao asithri aka scorpion's views), because of naivety, low intelligence, inability to think for themselves, family and peer pressure, disconnectedness from sri lankan reality, misguided loyalty to political parties, corruption, etc. indi (who also maintains another blog under the name padashow) is a good example of that kind of fool. let us hope such fools will wake up from their fantasies soon before they suffer permanent damage to their psyche.


11 comments:

jaya said...

Agreed. Anyone who believes what LTTE says must be an idiot, a racist, and a criminal to boot.

kewum said...

I think all "peaceniks" advocate peace, as opposed to war.

They are NOT saying "the LTTE are right".

They are NOT saying "the LTTE are the sole representatives of the Tamil people"

There are simply saying that it's better for the people of Sri Lanka to solve this problem with non-military means.

Get your facts straight, please.

prashantha said...

You say "(peaceniks) believe ltte's racist claim to be a representative of tamils".

Er..."the ltte's RACIST claim"?? How could the claiming to be A representative of Tamils, be a racist statement?

You say "(paceniks) are willing to excuse and ignore, ltte's killings, ethnic cleansing, oppression of people under ltte control, and lot of other atrocities".

But it seems you are are willing to excuse and ignore, the government's killings, ethnic cleansing, oppression of people, incompetence, opression of fredom of speech, etc. (I say this because you've never spoken out against these in you so called "libertarian" blog).

Man, I'd just like to ask, who is paying you to do this?

sittingnut said...

jaya:
thanks for the comment :-)

--
kewum:
I think all "peaceniks" advocate peace, as opposed to war
no they don't. read and think clearly first ( if you can )

if you actually read this blog you will see that i use the word "peacenik" to ppl who who think peace is worth any cost ( even at the cost of human rights, democracy, justice, and freedom ) . these peacniks ( all those mentioned above included) advocate giving power to ltte (which is not a representative of tamils and is against human rights etc.) in return for "peace"

you say these ppl are not saying "ltte is right" and "are the sole representatives of the Tamil people" ( though you wont find that in their own statements, quite the contrary in fact, when they urged gosl to talk to ltte while it insisted on being the sole representative at talks and elsewhere). anyway if they think ltte is not right and is not the representative of tamils, then why do these peaceniks advocate giving up basic principles of human rights, democracy, justice, and freedom by giving power over millions of ppl to a group of criminals ?

do you and they also advocate giving power and freedom instead of arresting to garden variety murderers, rapists, and thieves, so that we have less violence? what do you think makes ltte different from other criminals ( apart from the variety and spread of its atrocities )?

may be before asking me to get "the facts straight", you better learn to think clearly without getting muddled like an idiot .

-
as is said some ppl are peaceniks" because of naivety, low intelligence, inability to think for themselves, family and peer pressure, disconnectedness from sri lankan reality, misguided loyalty to political parties, corruption, etc". kewum is probably one of those

--
prashantha:

Er..."the ltte's RACIST claim"?? How could the claiming to be A representative of Tamils, be a racist statement?
terrorists claiming to be representative of tamils is a racist statement. bc because tamils do not support terrorists. may this is too much for your little head, but calling ppl of an ethnic group supporters of terrorism and other criminal activity is racist.

may be you think ltte is not criminal or terrorist ? if so tell us openly then we will know what kind if person you are.

But it seems you are are willing to excuse and ignore, the government's killings, ethnic cleansing, oppression of people, incompetence, opression of fredom of speech, etc. (I say this because you've never spoken out against these in you so called "libertarian" blog).

well you better read more first before lying ( it tells a great deal that you had to resort to blatant lies to make a point )
i have spoken against censorship( even of tamilnet ), incompetence, etc. i have also said anyone involved in killing civilians should be tried and punished if found guilty.

however i will not make absurd substantiated allegations against military based on propaganda from terrorists. nor is there any evidence for gosl conducted "ethnic cleansing". if you have evidence ( not empty allegations) for "ethnic cleansing" or "white van" abductions by gosl or military as a policy (not individual criminals) be my guest and let me know. so that i can condemn them.
so far in spite of my requests from ppl like you not single credible piece of evidence has been produced anywhere.

now if you objection to my post was principled and not a racist hysterical defense of ltte terrorism it is up to you to produce that credible evidence.

all my political posts are consistent with libertarian principles. if you think otherwise quote both me and the principle

Mohammed said...

Another fine post.

Posters OaO Asithri aka Scorpion, Nick, Mixer etc. are not the brainlessly racist caricatures they paint themselves out to be. They are simply tools in a campaign against Lanka Libertarian – one trying to discredit the content of the blog by creating a false 'righteous' indignation.

How very sad the Sri Lankan blogosphere has become.

peacenik18 said...

As a "peacenik", I feel compelled to respond to this post.

1. First, I want to say that I agree that terrorism should not be appeased in principle. LTTE are criminals, not dissimilar to murderers, rapists, thieves. No government should give in to terrorism.

2. My sole reason for being a "peacenik", and advocating a ceasefire and a negotiated settlement, is that I do not believe a military solution is possible against the LTTE. I wish it was. But I don't realistically think that we can defeat them militarily. (This in no way should be construed to mean that I do not support our brave security forces, of whom I am immensely proud.) I think that for various reasons, (corruption being the main reason, funds being the second) our military cannot defeat the LTTE. We therefore are forced into our only other option - peaceful negotiation with terrorists - as bitter a pill it is to swallow.

3. I think the policy you maintain is that the military should weaken the LTTE sufficiently to force them to come for talks. I do not realistically see this as a possibility. Firstly, I think the LTTE will never back down even if they are weak. Second, I don't think our military can weaken them, as explained above.

4. Let me clear something up. I do NOT think the LTTE are the sole representatives of the Tamil people. I wholeheartedly condemn their claim that they are.

4. However, going for talks with them does not imply that GoSL accepts that they are the sole representative of the Tamil people. The GoSL is made up of Tamil parties (EPDP, CWC) that are not affiliated to the LTTE. Therefore the peace talks that I advocate would involve many representatives of the Tamil people and not just the LTTE. Therefore it is wrong to say that peaceniks advocate talks with the LTTE as the sole represntatives of Tamils. This is just plain incorrect. I would never advocate talks on that basis, it would be a a terrible injustice to all the Tamils who live under the LTTE's yoke.

5. I absolutely condemn in no uncertain terms all of their HR violations, including but not limited to: child proscription, political assassinations, terrorism bombings of civilians, extortion of the diaspora, etc. I am against the LTTE. But I reiterate, I only advocate peace because I don't believe there is any other way to solve the problem.

6. I agree that there is a lack of evidence that the GoSL violates human rights (HR), as you say. But do you believe that the GoSL has never ever committed an HR violation? If your answer to this is no, please detail the HR violations the GoSL has committed and condemn them. I do not refer to Tamilnet censorship which you have already condemned, I refer to the charges of:

(a) killing of civilians in Tamil areas, either through aerial bombing, artillery shelling, or by military forces on the ground
(b) aiding of paramilitaries (Karuna faction) who use LTTE practices, such as child proscription
(c) assassination of political or other civilian figures
(d) rape of civilians by armed forces
(e) murders of civilians and/or aid workers
(f) abductions and disappearances
(g) harassment of journalists and/or censorship of free media (other than Tamilnet)
(h) forced evictions of Tamils from GoSL areas, sending them back into the arms of the oppressive LTTE
(i) manipulation and/or interference with the judicial system to prevent HR violators being brought to justice

Please go through each point and tell us whether you seriously believe the GoSL has NEVER committed any of these violations, lack of evidence notwithstanding.
I know you will say there is no evidence, but that is not the same as saying that the GoSL has never committed any of these violations. I anticipate that your answer will be that since there is no evidence, the GoSL is 100% innocent of these allegations and therefore has never committed any of these crimes. Do you really believe this is the case? If so, I'm afraid that I disagree with you.

Please sittingnut, I like your blog, and I agree with most of your sentiments. You are right that we should stand up to terrorism, you and I see eye-to-eye on that 100%. But please don't paint all us "peaceniks" with the same brush. The only, I repeat ONLY, reason I advocate peace is because I have no faith in defeating the LTTE militarily. (I have faith in the soldiers, but not the leaders). I wish we could win this militarily, but I don't think we can. I am sad to have to advocate appeasing terrorism, but I feel it is the only way we can solve this problem and get this country moving!

Reckless said...

Tamil Hindu suicide bomber goes on rampage:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZpVNAeNQcc

sittingnut said...

peacenik18:
thanks for the attempt at a coherent reply which more than i can say about most peaceniks.
unfortunately your arguments are as contradictory and weak as any peacenik's and in your 6th point you lose coherence altogether.

first you admit "LTTE are criminals, not dissimilar to murderers, rapists, thieves", ltte are not the sole representatives of the tamil people, "should not be appeased in principle", and that "No government should give in to terrorism". as you say i agree with those statements.

then you advocate appeasement on what may be termed by some as "pragmatic" grounds.

your argument is based on your assertion that ltte cannot be militarily defeated.

on the first place i don't know what your qualifications are to judge that. anyway there are some "experts " who agree with you. on the other hand military ppl and lot of other "experts" also hold the contrary view. so your assertion is far from certain. should we appease criminals and give up on principles, if there is a chance of defeating ltte? no imo. so your argument is weak and almost worthless give there is a chance of defeating ltte.

even in ( far from certain) case ltte cannot be defeated, is the "only other option", appeasement, as you say ? by no means. there are other options. for one we can fight on. we can contain and restrict the territory and ppl ltte can control limiting their ability to commit crimes and human rights violations.

personally i have always been of the view, as i have said in several posts before, that while we may never be able to eliminate ltte and thus their occasional attacks( esp suicide attacks) we can certainly restrict and reduce their power of coercion on sri lankans substantially. this has been proven again and again by our (and indian ) military when allowed to do their job without interruption of fake peace talks with cfa that buy ltte time. such a military champaign is what sl government should attempt to do and present one is in fact doing. i also think that any democratically elected government will be forced to do the same thing. mere assertion on your part that ltte cannot weakened is no argument when facts disagree with that assertion.

so even if we cannot eliminate ltte we should not appease the criminals and give up on principles of human rights, democracy etc.

finally say we appease an armed and unreformed ltte, does that mean we will have peace (even of we forget the unfortunates we have scarified to a living death by placing them under ltte control who will certainty not have “peace”)? no we won't, if history of ltte peace talks and history of appeasement of any fascist and terrorist group anywhere is any indication. why do you think ltte will behave any differently now than their own history and history of other fascist terrorists?

to summarize it is far from certain that ltte cannot be be defeated, even if it cannot be, we have other valid options and should fight on rather than give up on principles, and history teaches us that appeasement will not work in any case. in other words your main argument for appeasement as the only solution is without merit in its every stage

--
now for some details.
let us turn to your reasons why ltte cannot be defeated. you only give two after mentioning there are various reasons; "corruption being the main reason, funds being the second".

i think you have an exaggerated notion about corruption here. sri lankan corruption ( most of it conducted through hard to persecute channels or loopholes as elsewhere ) is not much different from any other country or any other war effort. in fact when there is public money there is corruption.
but the important thing for this argument is that net effect of corruption is to add a small percentage to the cost of procurements. that is not enough to make defeating ltte impossible. say for instance that the mig deal was corrupt ( it far from certain it was) but corrupt ppl could have got only a small percentage of the value of the deal. meanwhile we now have migs and they are effective. so how does that make defeating ltte impossible? you have to substantiate your argument why corruption makes defeating ltte impossible, otherwise it is worthless.

your other argument (lack) of funds is even weaker. we after all still spend only 3.5 % of the gdp on the defense much less than most peaceful countries. (in fact productivity wise our military is probably one of the best). we spend more on some other welfare items. so we have the option of increasing defense spending more if the need arises but we probably wont need to increase it all that much. remember we are not in a war mobilization situation as in most other countries with wars. which means that if we need we can mobilize much more resources. so unless you are going to explain what you mean by lack of funds your argument has no substance.

--
you say
it is wrong to say that peaceniks advocate talks with the LTTE as the sole represntatives of Tamils. This is just plain incorrect.
you are basically lying. ltte insisted that they are the sole representative and government admittance of that as a pre condition to talks. are you denying that ? are you denying that they were opposed to admitting even muslims to the discussion? (btw epdp was not in the unp government as a sop to ltte )are you basically denying why there is this sole representative debate in the first place? are you saying it was not an issue?

and all peaceniks ( in the sense i use that word ) advocated peace talks with a group that insisted on being sole representative. if you say otherwise point me to where they condemned ltte's insistence on sole representative status when others did so.

there is no problem with anyone advocating peace talks for tactical reasons as long as they make their own anti appeasement and anti sole representative stands clear. can you point to any evidence that peaceniks took an anti sole representative stand in any of the statements and press briefings etc that they are so fond of issuing when the last peace talks were on going? if not your argument is without substance.

--
finally your unquestioning belief in ltte propaganda, pro ltte mindset, and confusion of mind is evident in your 6th point. and the way you frame it (proving the falseness of your repeated condemnation of ltte).

in the first place why is that point here? this post is about racism of ppl who equate tamils with ltte. you should have made that point in another post where i dealt with white van conspiracies or some such allegation of hr violation by gosl . only reason why you put it here is your attempt at moral equalization of gosl with ltte. a sort of “a gosl is violating hr why not ltte” type of argument. if not please explain why it is here.

anyway you are free make that point here even though it is not relevant to the post ( unlike in peacenik blogs like groundviews i don't censor anyone ) and i will reply to that point.

to the main question whether gosl has committed hr violations? i would say yes. but not in the sense you meant it. in fact that question only displays your lack of knowledge and immaturity.

your
“I anticipate that your answer will be that since there is no evidence, the GoSL is 100% innocent of these allegations and therefore has never committed any of these crimes. Do you really believe this is the case? If so, I'm afraid that I disagree with you.”
only shows how little you are capable of logical or independent thinking. just because you are stupid, don't attribute your lack of intelligence to others please. i would never use confused logic you showed there ( lack of evidence does not necessarily prove innocence it merely says that suspect may not be guilty. and what is 100% innocent as opposed to 90% ? or 50%? could you explain. if that is too much for your small brain don't use such words )

my answer your stupid question is different.

as i have made clear in this blog and elsewhere all governments and all laws everywhere by definition violate human rights. if you can think with clarity you will see that this is true. that is why i am a libertarian and believe that governments and laws should be as “small” as possible. but that does not mean we have to condemn all governments and laws bc they are also necessary.

we for instance restrict rights of convicted criminals, violent mentally disturbed people, retailers, and factory owners, among others, to ensure the physical, mental, and environmental safety of society at large. is that condemnable? no.
in fact primary function of all governments is to make or break laws that restrict rights. if you understand that you will see that your question is a contradiction.

what you meant to ask was whether the gosl ( meaning its executive branch) has broken the legitimately enacted laws of the country. and whether i condemn them.

who decides that?
gosl like all executive branches everywhere occasionally step over the line. and usually judiciary or the legislative branches force them back within the law. this is what is meant by checks and balances in a democracy .

this why there is a fundamental rights application process to supreme court ( and similar processes elsewhere in world - ours is actually better since we get direct access to sc, while in usa cases have go through court hierarchy ) . in other words there is a process in place to check government breaking the laws. if anyone has a case with substance they have access to that process and make use of it ( as hundreds have done). even a court decision according to existing law is not the final answer . as elsewhere in the world legislative can change the law as well.

given that situation, imo anyone condemning gosl or military bc of some action has to point out why those allegations cannot proved through available legal channels.

that is why if i condemn a certain action by gosl i would base my decision on the specific facts of the case. so to answer your question when i have seen any condemnable action by gosl during the time i was active in this blog i have condemned it after looking into details.
you can look them up i am not going to go through my blog and point them out one by one. if you want to find out whether i have already condemned some action or not, and the reasons, you have to be specific and not generalize.

i do not condemn anyone esp gosl and military, without evidence. does that mean they are 100% innocent as you stupidly put it ? no but it does mean they are not guilty according to evidence, and i don't have a right to condemn if we don't have any contrary evidence. do you think it is right to condemn military or gosl without evidences that will stand up in court esp when the allegations are propagated by ltte terrorists and their parrots ?

now let us look at your sub points asking for condemnation..

(a) killing of civilians in Tamil areas, either through aerial bombing, artillery shelling, or by military forces on the ground
first what do you mean by “Tamil areas” did you mean “ltte controlled areas”? your pro ltte racist mindset equating “tamil” with ltte is apparent from that slip.
as far as i know there wasn't any intentional targeting of civilians so there is nothing to condemn. if you have evidence you can produce them. if there was such intentional targeting i will condemn it . on the other hand sl military should target ltte criminal positions as required. they have a legitimate right to do so. accidents esp when ltte uses so called “human shields” is inevitable as in all wars.

(b) aiding of paramilitaries (Karuna faction) who use LTTE practices, such as child proscription
you mean “conscription”?
are you saying military is aiding them to conscript child soldiers? if so you are wrong .
if you are saying that military is helping paramilitaries protect themselves against ltte, probably yes. i don't condemn that as long as those paramilitaries are willing to disarm and transform to political parties once ltte is substantially defeated (and take steps as karuna faction has done, to release child soldiers they do have). or do you want military to fight them ? while talking peace to ltte? that attitude more than anything shows your pro ltte bias. paramilitaries being comparatively weak, dependent, and fractured, are and will be willing to make peace, and if not easy to control ( in fact that is one of the aims of aiding them, instead allowing them to find their own methods of procurements). so why fight them now when peace with them unlike with lltte is a real possibility ?

(c) assassination of political or other civilian figures “
since members of ltte are not civilians, and as far as i know there is hasn't been any case of for gosl or militray engaging assassination of others as a policy this point is empty. you have to be more specific instead of vague like ltte propaganda.


(d) rape of civilians by armed forces
there are no rape by “armed forces” as such ,only by few indisciplined individuals in armed forces ( given the numbers involved such things will happen as in normal society). your generalization of the point indicate your really anti armed forces attitude ( if you are proud of the armed forces as you said, you would not have made that generalization). if individuals in armed forces ( or elsewhere) commit rape or any other crime i condemn that and expect the required disciplinary actions be carried out (according to law not prejudice btw ). as far as i know when there is a real case ppl has been convicted and are in jail.

(e) murders of civilians and/or aid workers
another generalization without giving specifics. are you referring to muttur case? only pro ltte peacenik will believe there is any military involvement in that given the evidence. you can read what i think about that in posts where i dealt with it.
as i said if you have any evidence for intentional “ murders of civilians and/or aid workers” by gosl , let me know so that i can condemn them .


(f) abductions and disappearances
again you can read about them and what i think about white van conspiracy theories in the relevant posts . there you will see what i condemn and what don't . if you want clarifications be more specific.

(g) harassment of journalists and/or censorship of free media (other than Tamilnet) “
i have and will condemn all curbs on freedom of expression. whether individual cases are real harassment, normal course of justice, fmm induced pro ltte propaganda, attempts at claiming insurance by a cash strapped editor, or other, have to be decided after examining specifics of the case

(h) forced evictions of Tamils from GoSL areas, sending them back into the arms of the oppressive LTTE
again you are engaging in exaggerated generalization, parroting ltte propaganda exposing your real sympathies. there was no eviction of “tamils” only of ppl without any valid reason for staying in colombo. you can read the whole of my argument in my and others blog posts about the subject.

(i) manipulation and/or interference with the judicial system to prevent HR violators being brought to justice “
can you elaborate with specifics. if there is evidence for that it is condemnable but as i said i will not engage is speculations bc of mere allegations.

what is clear in all of the above is that you are reluctant to go in to specifics knowing well that you cannot make a credible case if you do. you are merely repeating what you heard through some ltte propaganda or ltte parroting peacenik source.

as you will see in relevant posts when gosl has done something i can condemn i have condemned it after examining details. but i will not engage in condemnation of military or gosl without evidence just bc ltte propaganda says so. question is why you are willing to condemn gosl and militray just bc ltte propaganda says so when as is clear you are not even familiar with specific details of relevant cases

your own words indicate your real sympathies. if you are not a ltte sympathizer please explain how the kinds of slips pointed out above could occur .
--

as it stands your own words indicate your are a paecenik appeaser willing to believe and parrot anything that ltte propaganda dish out without questioning and willing to give up participles of human rights, democracy , justice and freedom, for a mirage of “peace” with ltte. your attempt to justify that appeasement as different from other peaceniks' does not contain one argument of substance. your attempt to go off topic with irrelevant accusations against gosl or military only ended up exposing your true sympathies.
so you are a peacenik as the all the rest; a person who is willing to appease ltte crimes

sittingnut said...

mohammed:
thanks for the comment.
i think any intelligent person can make out what OaO Asithri aka Scorpion, Nick, Mixer etc. are. such ppl will not get anywhere whatever their intentions once confronted with sanity and facts.

reckless:
video i linked in sthis post is the original released by the mod. others in youtube or elsewhere are copies made from that.

Just Mal said...

I don't think Asithri is a brainlessly racist caricature. The man's in it for real.

I don't think Tamils should be deported en masse, but sometimes it's comforting to think that we can, particularly after a bomb like this.

The government, however, should use the widest net possible to arrest, detain, and question as many suspicious Tamils as possible. This should be coupled with a multipronged domestic PR campaign against human rights groups and other treasonous peaceniks who oppose such measures.

Someone said...

WELCOME BACK JUST MAL!